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Red96
Joined: 30 Dec 2020 Posts: 46 Location: Pacific Northwest
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Posted: Mon Jan 18, 2021 6:08 pm Post subject: Anyone tried using UV-cure adhesives? |
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Scratch-building a chassis & cage and frustrated with how long joints stay soft when using either Tamiya liquid glues or CA type glues. Was wondering if anyone's tried the UV cured adhesives designed for PS plastics? If these truly reach full hardness in a few seconds' of UV exposure, it'd be the shizzle for building cages & chassis.
96 |
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Dennis O Board Moderator
Joined: 28 Jan 2018 Posts: 879 Location: Louisville, Ky.
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Posted: Mon Jan 18, 2021 7:08 pm Post subject: |
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Curious to hear.... _________________ Dennis
Artificial Intelligence is no match for Natural Stupidity....... |
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Len Woodruff
![](http:////images41.fotki.com/v868/photos/2/219739/965161/IMG_3034sm-vi.jpg)
Joined: 28 Jan 2018 Posts: 100 Location: Frisco, TX
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Posted: Tue Jan 19, 2021 8:02 am Post subject: |
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I like to hear too.
Like so many I am sure the are better/wrose uses for each of the glue types when building model cars.
I do always use the Kicker for the CA glues. |
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18degrees
![](http://i.imgur.com/bRHsgcNt.jpg)
Joined: 01 Feb 2018 Posts: 1021 Location: metro STL area, ILLINois
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Posted: Tue Jan 19, 2021 7:00 pm Post subject: |
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Hey Red96
Can you re-size your avatar please? _________________ ON DECK/IN THE WORKS: too many started to list...
![](https://i.imgur.com/ObnnOKft.jpg) |
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Firefly
![](http://i.imgur.com/B1NdRAP.gif)
Joined: 28 Jan 2018 Posts: 810 Location: New Jersey
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Posted: Thu Jan 21, 2021 7:52 am Post subject: |
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My dentist uses UV cure filling material. Curious about this.
I love Plastruct butyl coated wire for fabbing cage bars but the butyl plastic does not bond well with styrene cement. Might work with that. _________________ Bill Jobson is my real name. |
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Red96
Joined: 30 Dec 2020 Posts: 46 Location: Pacific Northwest
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Posted: Sat Jan 23, 2021 10:47 am Post subject: |
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So I've found a UV adhesive designed for plastics (not as common as you'd think), and the correct wavelength UV light for curing. Just waiting for the UV battery to charge to do some testing. Will report back with the good, the bad, and the ugly on this boondoggle.
BTW, apologies for the obnoxious avatar that was up for a day or two. Not very adept at resizing and whatnot, obviously. |
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Red96
Joined: 30 Dec 2020 Posts: 46 Location: Pacific Northwest
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Posted: Sat Jan 23, 2021 10:50 am Post subject: |
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Firefly wrote: | My dentist uses UV cure filling material. Curious about this.
I love Plastruct butyl coated wire for fabbing cage bars but the butyl plastic does not bond well with styrene cement. Might work with that. |
Firefly, thanks for mentioning those coated wires. Had no idea they existed - what a great idea. Thanks. Learn something new every single time I log in here! |
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Red96
Joined: 30 Dec 2020 Posts: 46 Location: Pacific Northwest
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Posted: Mon Jan 25, 2021 5:55 pm Post subject: |
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So for those who were also curious...I've done some experimenting with UV cured adhesive and will share my thoughts. Just PM me if you want more detail.
To premise: I was looking for a better way to build scratch cages and frames without the fragility & extended dry times that kill progress.
First off, there's very few UV cured adhesives designed for plastics, at least in a non-industrial setting. I found one that was good for a whole list of plastics, Polystyrene being one of them... Permabond UV640. It's a bit spendy - for the small container (50ml) its was about $45 w/shipping from Fastenal.
For curing, you won't get a decent light for cheap either. There's a ton of "UV" lights available for a song, but those do not have the correct light spectrum to cure these adhesives. Most of the cheapy lights are in the 345 or lower nanometer wavelength, and will not cure this adhesive. Most of the UV adhesives cure in a fairly narrow spectrum just above that (365 - 400 nm) I found a well-reviewed (FWTW) flashlight-style lamp on Amazon that was 365 nm for $25 bones.
The adhesive comes in a small squeeze bottle with a pointy tip that is decent at getting the contents where you intend. Viscosity is about par with 10w oil. Stays more or less where you drop it, but not highly resistant to cappilary action so just tap the dot with a toothpick and it flows out into the joint. Curing starts to occur about 3-4 sec after you put the light to it. You can take as much time as you want to get positioned before putting the light to it - it won't tack up or cure until you give it the purple glower. The adhesive is thick enough that it does a really nice job on cage joints in flowing the tubes into a more fitted-looking joint. Also, it will bridge small gaps easily (.010-.020"), so no worries if your a bit off on your part length.
Strength-wise, I was pretty impressed with the results. You can challenge the joint after just a few seconds of light-cure, and the hold is suprisingly strong. Scuffing the rod first helps with the bond. The cured adhesive seems to sand well. Not sure it would feather-out real great, but is shape-able with files, sand paper, etc. Being expensive to use, it's certainly not the solution for all your glueing needs, but it certainly has a place in your toolbox IMO. The quick cure is great for progressing on cages and such, or if you need to scab something onto another piece and can't hold it in an awkward position while waiting for solvent or CA glues to set. Also, the extended working/positioning time it avails you can be worth the price of admission alone. Example: Glued together a quickchange rear diff this weekend. Case halves and side plates. Trying to align all 4 parts before CA glue starts to kick so that an aluminum tube can slide through the center wasn't an option. Wetted it up with UV, aligned everything, put a couple pieces of tape to stabilze and THEN hit with the light. Worked like a dream. Probably helped that the pieces were semi-transparent as well.
Hope this is valuable info for somebody else!
Cheers,
96
PS. This stuff does NOT adhere to HDPE plastic, so if you use a cutting board like me to work on, no worries that the UV will glue your parts to the worktop. |
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Dennis O Board Moderator
Joined: 28 Jan 2018 Posts: 879 Location: Louisville, Ky.
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Posted: Mon Jan 25, 2021 6:50 pm Post subject: |
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Excellent write up!!! _________________ Dennis
Artificial Intelligence is no match for Natural Stupidity....... |
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Red96
Joined: 30 Dec 2020 Posts: 46 Location: Pacific Northwest
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Posted: Mon Feb 01, 2021 4:28 pm Post subject: |
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So, now that I've had some more time using this adhesive, there's a couple of things that I thought I should point out.
First, there is an odor. It's a faint, acrid smell that you'll recognize from the Dentist's office perhaps. It's the acrylic component, and I've found that after a couple hours it gives me a headache. I only put out a drop or two out at a time onto a piece of scrap and transfer to parts with a toothpick. But, that small drop is enough to generate the smell. Some might not be as sensative to it, but I grew up in a body shop and the smell of lacquer thinner doesn't phase me a bit, so that may be a relevent concern. Better ventilation would help, but not available in my current workspace. Once you cure the dispensed adhesive the smell disappears, so I've learned to hit whatever I've dispensed out with the light when I'm done using the UVA so it stops smellling until you open the container again. I'm only using the UVA when it benefits. Also probably not the best thing to get onto your skin.
Second, the bond. UVA is not the strongest option at our disposal. Solvent type glues provide, IMO the strongest joint between Polystyrene parts after sufficient cure time - certainly stronger than the UVA. I find myself using the UVA to tack something challanging into position, then following up with solvent to strengthen the overall bond. I find the UVA especially helpful when doing cages and chassis components. You can hold a member with one end in place with the other end in a 'ballpark' location, cure it, then reposition the other end more accurately and cure it into place.
Hopefully these other observations are helpful.
96 |
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